Presented with little comment – equities and bonds are diverging aggressively now as 10Y accelerates towards its all-time low yields (1.67 on 9/23). As we noted earlier, foreigners are dumping Treasuries at a record pace and yet it grinds tighter and stocks rally on USD weakness. Our ‘thesis’ from yesterday that a reactive Fed QE is being priced in seems the most ‘sensible’ but year-end flows for now are tough to call.
and its not just Treasuries (or 2s10s30s) that are derisking as CONTEXT (risk asset basket proxy) is leaking lower quite consistently…
Gold is up, EURJPY is leaking lower (FX carry) and Oil is coming off from its highs now.
It may not be iambic pentameter or Shakespearean sonnet-worthy but the venerable Art Cashin delivers his now traditional year-end poetic summation of all things newsworthy – old and new.
‘Tis two days yet to New Year
but despite what you’re hopin’
The folks in the Board Room
say “the full day we’re open”
So we’ll buy and we’ll sell
as the tape crawls along
And though “Bubbly’s” verboten
we may still sing a song
Two Thousand Eleven
looked good at the start
But deadlocks in D.C.
took things all apart
We finished up with a rally
thanks to old Santa Claus
But some late Euro troubles
Almost caused us to pause
We lost special people
as we seem to each year
It just makes us treasure
each one that’s still here
Peter Falk, dear Columbo
put his raincoat away
James Arness, Marshall Dillon
wears a new star today
Jack Kevorkian left us
without an assist
Harry Morgan, Colonel Potter
will also be missed
And Christopher Hitchens
said of God he had doubt
Now he’s taken that journey
when we each will find out
Andy Rooney’s curmudgeon
up to heaven has gone
Jack La Lanne and his juicer
have also moved on
Amy Winehouse so troubled
has joined heaven’s choir
And Betty Ford also
in this year did expire
Joe Frazier, once smokin’
went down for the count
And Jane Russell, the Outlaw
found a heavenly mount
Liz Taylor’s great beauty
now in heaven’s halls glows
Jackie Cooper, the child star
donned some angelic clothes
Steve Jobs left his iPad
he won’t need it now
His final words as he left us
were just a simple “Oh Wow!”
Mark Haines left the floor too
without saying good-bye
Though he growled & he grumbled
he was still a good guy
Kim Jong Il has departed
yet North Korea’s no fun
We’re stuck with his third kid
who he named Kim Jong Un
Navy Seals got Bin Laden
now Khaddafi’s gone too
Two of the worst kind
that we ever knew
Japan had a huge earthquake
followed by a great wave
Which engulfed a reactor
that they couldn’t quite save
A tornado hit Joplin
Alabama slammed too
Lots of tears then rebuilding
nothing else could they do
And in once civil Norway
one day folks ceased to smile
When a gun totting loner
shot some kids on an isle
While in Middle East cities
young folks took to the streets
And they spoke to each other
Using YouTube and tweets
In Washington – Gridlock
was the theme of the year
It brought ratings cuts to us
and left nothing to cheer
Up sprang “Occupy Wall Street”
it was almost a flop
‘Til a YouTube explosion
of that pepper spray cop
Corzine’s MF Global
misplaced lots of dough
When they asked where it went
he said – damned if I know
Herman Cain scored debate points
his three “nines” moved up fast
But he made a quick exit
shocked by things from his past
We saw Merkel, Sarkozy
a cliff-hanger in Greece
Bonga boy Berlusconi
claimed some girl was his niece
The Prez had a few struggles
in the polls he did slip
Prompting new speculation
that Hil & Biden he’ll flip
Casey Anthony’s jury
somehow had a doubt
And some Italian justice
let Amanda Knox out
A chambermaid pointed
to a guy named Strause-Kahn
But the District Attorney
said her tale was a con
And then Anthony Weiner
emailed some pointed tweets
Charlie Sheen had a meltdown
as he screamed of his feats
Let not this year’s memories
of sadness or sleaze
Disturb you this day
just give your heart ease
Have faith that this New Year
will bring a new sign
And believe in yourself
it will all work out fine
Just lift up your spirits
and some fruit of the vine
And kiss ye a loved one
and sing Auld Lange Syne
And late in the evening
as you watch the ball fall
Wish yourself all the best
Happy New Year to All!!
Via Peter Tchir of TF Market Advisors,
Rather than making some predictions, here is a list of words and phrases that were popular in 2011 that just annoy me. It would be nice if they become less popular in 2012, but I predict they will remain in use.
No self-respecting videogame would have a “bazooka” as the ultimate weapon. Bazookas just aren’t that powerful. Maybe Europe needs to search for a “nuclear” option, that at least sounds big enough to scare people. Or, just maybe, Europe needs a credible plan for debt sustainability rather than a “weapon”.
No policy ever fails anymore, it just had “unintended consequences”. Unintended consequences sounds better than sloppy planning, but when a consequence is forseeable and likely, it is not unintended. Unwanted, yes, but unintended, no. If I punch someone in the face, and they punch me back and break my nose, that is not an unintended consequence. It is not the result I was looking for, but it is a completely logical outcome. We will never get to the point where decision makers admit that they made bad decisions or didn’t think things through carefully, but unintended consequences is not an excuse.
Not everything that is bad is a black swan. Black swans are things that no one thought could exist (based on some amount of analysis) that turn out to exist. The Fukushima plant was a disaster, but not a black swan. They just didn’t plan well enough for a likely possibility. It seems like small mistakes are covered up by being “unintended consequences” and big mistakes are covered up by saying they were “black swans”. Accountability would be much better.
Transitory sounds much better than temporary. Maybe it is used because everyone knows what temporary means, but transitory is a little harder to nail down. The Fed in particular has embraced “transitory”. Anything that occurs that they don’t like is deemed as “transitory”. This is even better than talking about unintended consequences because it implies you have actually thought of everything and that the bad stuff will go away. Maybe that is why Ben really, really, really likes it. CPI was 3.4% over the last 12 months, that doesn’t exactly seem “transitory” to me.
Bipartisan is a myth. In American politics it has come to mean that the other side decides to agree to your view, or that both sides get what they want. In no case does it imply a willingness on your part to change your stance materially.
Why is someone who invests in gold, considered a “gold bug”. Why are shorts constantly reminded that being short a stock can cause you have unlimited losses? I know far more people who have lost 100% of their money being long, and no one who has lost an infinite amount of money being short. Maybe it is just a cute term, or maybe it is a way to disparage people who invest in anything other than stocks and bonds.
CDS and ISDA and Credit Events
Okay, I’m not bored with this one and hope it gets used more in the future, but am shocked how many people who have never read the ISDA Credit Derivative Definitions, have never traded a CDS, have strong opinions on the subject.
How January goes, the year goes
We are about to hit that time of the year, where everyone points out how the first day in January is important, or the first week, or the first month. The S&P 500 went up over 1% on January first last year to hit 1272. It ended the month at 1282. On the bright side, it looks like that “buy” signal worked as the S&P is going to finish the year positively, but anyone who bought at the end of January will have lost money. All these rules of thumb and “ideas” based on historical annoy me, but I am sure we will hear about how important the first trading day and week are again. It is kind of ironic that in 2010 almost the entire gain in the S&P was captured on the first day of the month. In 2011, the entire gain was captured in the first trading day of the year.
We are going to get even more summits this year, but we have done it to ourselves. Somehow we have decided that phones are insufficient and the only way to properly rally around a Grand Plan announcement is at a fancy summit.
Somehow we changed what a “realist” is. Things that at one time would have been considered giddy with optimism are now “the norm”. Looking at facts and analyzing them and coming up with negative conclusions leads to being a labeled a cynic or even a “doomer”, yet those conclusions have turned out to be correct more often than not.
Dude, when was the last time you made it to the gym?
That is just depressing and mean, but may be more of a personal issue, than a market one.
Have a Happy New Year and a great 2012 and thanks for all your support and comments and helpful insights.
Something strange is happening in European risk markets this week. While that sentence is entirely ‘normal’ for what has become a diverging/converging flip-flopping correlation microstructure but the clear trend this week has been European Sovereign derisking and European Stock rerisking. The Bloomberg 500 index (that tracks a broad swathe of European stocks) is up 0.75% from Christmas Eve (and 1.6% from yesterday’s lows) while 10Y sovereign spreads are wider by 10 to 30bps in the same period. France stands out as one of the worst performers – more than 25bps wider this week alone. Only Spain is notably improved on the week (-17bps) but all 10Y sovereigns are well off their best levels as stocks make new highs. Whether this is a front-run on asset rotation into the new year or expectations of the same risk-on ramp-job we saw on the first trading of this year is unclear – we do remind those front-runners that mutual fund cash levels are significantly lower this year than last. It is clear that yet another ‘sensible’ correlation (such as BTPs to equities) has broken but when volumes return and the reality of the huge supply calendar we face in the next month alone sinks in, perhaps equity ebullience will pull to bond bereavement. If stocks are reacting to a quasi-QE from the ECB, why wouldn’t sovereigns who are the direct beneficiaries in that surreal LTRO-driven-carry trade.
The highly correlated relationship between European stocks and sovereign risk has decoupled in the last week or so – and not in a good LTRO-carry-trade-driven way.
Stocks are up nicely this week…
but sovereigns are all (except Spain for now) wider on the week post Christmas. The French 10Y is the stand-out to us though – quietly widening almost 26bps this week (from 105bps to 131bps) or 25%…and BTPs are 36bps wide of their tights from Wednesday. Hardly a reassuring signal from the markets – even with the ECB rumored to have been buying this week.
The only thing of note today (there are no economic announcements at all, just the Fed disclosing the latest Op Twist schedule at 2 pm) is that while the bond market closes at 2pm, stocks will be left unsupervised for two hours of sheer idiocy between then and their normal closing time of 4pm by which point there will be nobody left trading, just some GETCO algo lifting every offer then dumping it all having made money over VWAP and suckered in the momos, as happens every single day on no volume levitation.
As for the big picture, for those three people who care, here is Stone McCarthy‘s explanation:
Even as the trend is still higher for Treasury prices (lower for yields) since the October lows, it can be argued that a significant deceleration in this trend is underway. Specifically, while there is always the possibility that Treasury prices can overshoot their December highs on thin flows during the trend deceleration process in the days ahead, the multi-year CFTC COT-related extremes and diverging weekly momentum that preceded the 12/19 price highs increase the likelihood that any move to new price highs would be short-lived. In addition, despite the fact that it has occurred during the quietest 2-week period of the year, recent gains by the S&P 500 offer structural potential for further gains of roughly 2.5% to 3.9% (SPX 1293 to 1311) from current levels over the near-term, as long as SPX 1229 holds during the current equity correction.
As we noted on Wednesday, the trend that had been driving Treasury prices lower (yields higher) since the early part of last week was neutralized during Wednesday’s rally, resulting in a more rangebound outlook for Treasury prices. Currently, the active 10-Yr contact is working in the direction of the high-end of this range near 131-05. This will remain the case until a sustained intra-day breach of 130-13+ opens the door to the low-end of the range near 129-30
By Karl Denninger, The Market Ticker
As 2011 slithers to its end, none of the major problems that led to the crisis point three years ago have really been solved. Bank balance sheets still reek. Europe day by day becomes a financial black hole, with matter from the periphery being sucked toward the center until the vortex itself collapses. The Street and its ministries of propaganda have fallen back on a Big Lie as old as capitalism itself: that all that has gone wrong has been government’s fault. This time, however, I don’t think the argument that “Washington ate my homework” is going to work. This time, a firestorm is going to explode about the Street’s head – and about time, too.
Over the next year, I expect the “what” will give way to the “how” in the broad electorate’s comprehension of the financial situation. The 99 percent must learn to differentiate the bloodsuckers and rent-extractors from those in the 1 percent who make the world a better, more just place to live. Once people realize how Wall Street made its pile, understand how financiers get rich, what it is that they actually do, the time will become ripe for someone to gather the spreading ripples of anger and perplexity into a focused tsunami of retribution. To make the bastards pay, properly, for the grief and woe they have caused. Perhaps not to the extent proposed by H. L. Mencken, who wrote that when a bank fails, the first order of business should be to hang its board of directors, but in a manner in which the pain is proportionate to the collateral damage. Possibly an excess-profits tax retroactive to 2007, or some form of “Tobin tax” on transactions, or a wealth tax. The era of money for nothing will be over.
But it won’t just end with taxes. When the great day comes, Wall Street will pray for another Pecora, because compared with the rough beast now beginning to strain at the leash, Pecora will look like Phil Gramm. Humiliation and ridicule, even financial penalties, will be the least of the Street’s tribulations. There will be prosecutions and show trials. There will be violence, mark my words. Houses burnt, property defaced. I just hope that this time the mob targets the right people in Wall Street and in Washington. (How does a right-thinking Christian go about asking Santa for Mitch McConnell’s head under the Christmas tree?) There will be kleptocrats who threaten to take themselves elsewhere if their demands on jurisdictions and tax breaks aren’t met, and I say let ’em go!
Hoh hoh hoh.
Michael Thomas is right, you know. I’ve been trying to get purchase for draining the swamp and punishing the wrongdoers among the various political classes in DC and elsewhere for a long time, in some cases dating back to the 1990s. My stock in trade is mathematics — that irrespective of the money flowing into the coffers of campaigns and lobbying offices what’s being attempted cannot work and as a consequence we are choosing between doing the right thing now and having it suck and doing it later by force and having it suck more.
Why appeal to people in this way? Well, what else do you have when the base case — that you should do the right thing because it’s right — no longer has any currency? In a city (DC) and nation (America) where bribery and corruption have become a way of life, where lies told to the electorate as a means of buying votes has become the degenerate set that’s left of what used to pass for law and order, you can no longer appeal to people’s “better virtues.”
All that’s left is trying to appeal to their desire to survive what’s coming, whether that survival is political or at rather-more-fundamental level.
This isn’t the sort of thing that anyone wants to talk of openly, of course, but we must, because just like mathematics it is inevitable on the path we are on. The idea that one can “throw money from helicopters” as Bernanke has put forward is an intentional fraud. Diluting the currency base of course simply makes everything more expensive you need while attempting to bail out those in debt at the same time. For the common man in debt nothing happens. For the poor who never had access to credit at a material level they literally starve and thus civil and political order is threatened. The wealthy, for their part, simply skim off more and more to “protect” their capital. That a man who runs this sort of crap manages to get reconfirmed after intentionally averting his eyes to the bubble being blown as a consequence of his policies is an outrage. It speaks to the high corruption of public process and public life, but it is not an isolated incident or uncommon in the world of today.
The IMF’s Lagarde talks of Europe being “everyone’s problem”, as if Germany and France decided to con the world with hinky Greek derivative deals. Perhaps some French or German banks did so (along with American ones), but France and Germany themselves? No. But now, having happened, it suddenly is someone else’s problem to bail out, and oh by the way, it’s not just Greece.
At its core the problem is both simpler and more complex than it first appears. The complexity is intentionally used as a foil by various pundits and others who argue that we must support the “financial innovators” lest it all go somewhere else. But Paul Volcker, hardly a dummy, has said in public that the only real “innovation” in the financial industry in the last 30 years was the ATM!
He’s right, you know. Ginning up some debt deal and selling it to rubes, knowing full well that it was crap and destined to eventually blow up, is nothing new at all. A column over at Interfluidity argues that the bankster model is not only old hat but has driven much of innovation through the ages. To that argument I call bull.
Simply put the question being put forward in the latter article proceeds from a false premise. The idea that we gain some sort of “societal benefit” from these misallocations of capital is trivially proved to be false using nothing more than basic analysis and mathematics. All you have to do is look here:
Notice how the outstanding debt increase, quarter by quarter, exceeds that of output. The premise run by Interfluidity is that the societal good in terms of Nash Equilibria is therefore false, as it is not adjusted for the claims made against the future. This of course is exactly the sort of lie the banksters and politicians have run as their stock in trade for 30 years, and it is not surprising at all that Steve would fall into the trap. After all most of us alive have spent the majority of our lives in this lie.
If I can falsify the premise from which you proceed then the remainder of your argument goes in the ashcan. Sorry Steve.
The smartest guys in the room (that would be the banksters) always believe they can get away with it, of course. Some of them are delusional, many for the same reasons. A number of those who are considered “respectable” even subscribe to idiocies like “MMT”, believing that somehow the government causes economic growth through deficit spending.
But the graph above does not lie. As I have repeatedly commented these beliefs are much like perpetual motion in its various forms; there is always someone who claims to have figured it out. But the laws of thermodynamics say perpetual motion is impossible, and ultimately once again the person running the scheme is proved to be wrong — usually intentionally so when their hidden energy source is discovered.
The choice is not between a modern economic system that favors growth and living in caves. It is between economic progress that is sustainable and funded from economic surplus and one that is built on debt bubbles, lies, and ultimately must and does collapse.
The former is an economy that grows through actual innovation and improvement in productivity, where debt is a tool to liquify transaction flow rather than pyramid upon the shoulders of the people. The latter is the lie we’ve lived for 30 years, and which is now reaching its mathematical conclusion.
We face a time when in the present we have a choice of becoming adults and accepting what we’ve done, along with what we must do, or continuing to pound on the table like a petulant child demanding another bar of chocolate. The latter path has been the road of the last 30 years, but now the supply of chocolate is exhausted. There is food to be had outside in the form of strawberries, ears of corn and even a rabbit or three, but to obtain the latter we must get off our collective asses and pick the strawberries, cultivate the corn or shoot, skin and cook the rabbit. We are choosing now between recognition and personal effort, along with acceptance of the harm we’ve done by eating all that chocolate (we’re all 100lbs overweight!) or literal starvation through laziness.
The old political and bankster ways are out of gas folks. There is no path forward on the road we’ve been traveling — the bridge is out and our choice is to either stop before we reach the edge or take the plunge onto the rocky cliffs below.
By Karl Denninger, The Market Ticker
America has a terrible saving problem and a slumping economy. But our national mantra, underscored by last week’s payroll-tax cut, is spend, spend, spend.
Countries can’t spend their way to prosperity. This demand- side voodoo-economics approach is driving us further into hock. The right mantra should be save, save, save.
Hoh hoh hoh…
Back to fundamental truths, my friends:
- Nobody ever lends anyone money at an intentional loss.
- Due to the mathematical essence of exponents two compound functions will always run away from each other over time.
That’s the beginning and end of it economically. “Spend spend spend” can never work because capital formation requires saving and when you replace capital formation with debt you are guaranteed, in aggregate, to lose.
Noodle on those two basic principles above a bit and it will snap into focus: A lender of capital will always seek to charge more than the growth rate in the economy (otherwise he’d rather do something with the capital other than lend it to you) which means that when capital formation as the predicate for business formation and investment is replaced by debt — what banks and the financial industry calls “credit” — the spread guarantees that eventually the amount of debt will rise hyperbolically compared to output.
I know I’ve shown this chart dozens of times, but until we break this cycle we will never have actual economic prosperity.
That will always happen.
There’s only one way to stop it — don’t do that. Don’t rely on “credit” for economic expansion. Economically force expansion to be funded by economic surplus — that is, capital formation.
People recoil in horror when I say “force”, but in point of fact the government doesn’t have to force anything. The “force” in question are natural economic forces and they act all on their own if the government stops backstopping and subsidizing the use of debt instead of capital.
Fannie, Freddie, the rescue of AIG, Student Loans, Medicare/Medicaid, the bailout of GM and Chrysler, backstopping Citibank as many times as you have fingers in the last 30 years, refusal to instantly jail all the officers of MF Global when the missing segfunds were discovered and more — all come down to one thing: Government’s intentional distortion of the markets.
This should not surprise — after all, if government was to use capital instead of debt it would have to tax more and spend less! That is, the same “basic” principle applies at the government level. It’s not quite identical in that government doesn’t produce (directly) and thus there is no “economic surplus” per-se, but in general it can either fund its programs with economic surplus (which it taxes from the people — by definition economic surplus since if you can’t pay and survive you cease to be a taxpayer) or it can replace economic surplus with debt.
The cessation of these policies beings with government.
We either do it now or we’ll do it the hard way. Both paths suck — we’re only choosing which sucks less, and the longer we wait to do the right thing the worse it’s going to be.
By Karl Denninger, The Market Ticker
This is pissing me off.
Remember the family that was slaughtered by a Santa-dressed gunman who then shot himself? This is the latest from the “mainstream” press:
LANCASTER, Texas – Family friends say a Texas man accused of killing six relatives in a Christmas Day murder-suicide was struggling financially and didn’t like that his estranged wife was doing well.
Hmmm…. that’s a sad story, isn’t it? One of rage, money problems, a sign of the times, right?
But a more ominous portrait emerged of Yazdanpanah in interviews with some of his daughter’s other classmates.
“She would come to school crying and telling us her dad was crazy,” said Lacie Reed, 18. “He wouldn’t let her wear certain things. He was always taking her phone away, checking her call history and checking her text messages.”
Friends said Nona’s father had installed cameras all around the home so he could watch the family’s comings and goings. Others said he nailed her bedroom window shut so she could not sneak out at night and see her boyfriend.
“She couldn’t date at all until she was a certain age, but when he was going to let her date she couldn’t date anyone outside of their race or religion,” Reed said.
Yiselle Alvarenga, 18, said Nona’s mother and brother seemed to come to her aid when her father punished her.
“He would take her phone away and her mother would give it back to her and her brother would let her use his phone,” Alvarenga said. “She was doing good. She was just excited that her life was going to start and she was going to have control of it.”…
Oh, I see. And yet this side of the story — that this might have been a Muslim “Honor Killing” — was omitted from the lamestream media’s coverage.
Gee, I wonder why? There’s nothing particularly bigoted about saying that your daughter cannot date outside of her religion or race, right?
How quickly would that make the news if the person in question was white and the boyfriend was black? How quickly would it make the news if the person in question was a Christian and they were forbidden to date a Jew?
In minutes, right? It would be all over the national media.
So….. why isn’t it?
By Karl Denninger, The Market Ticker
Look folks, it’s simple — what the IMF wants, what the banksters want, here, there, everywhere, is the same thing: Your money, as much as they can get, and they don’t care what happens to you.
Austerity policies are now widely regarded as having failed, and this failure is increasingly obvious in the country elected to act as Austerity’s Child. The banking collapse, and the legacy bequeathed by the Irish state’s extraordinary September 2008 bank guarantee, has seen society in Ireland reshaped as a petri dish for IMF, European commission and ECB experimentation. Successive waves of cuts have been stipulated by the Troika in return for its loans, but implemented without resistance, and arguably, a degree of enthusiasm, by the two governments of the “post-sovereign” era.
Yep. I said originally that Ireland should give the finger to the banksters, and if the government refused then the people should give the finger to the government, ejecting and replacing it.
What is “give the finger”?
Simple; you tell them this: You made a bad loan, you’re going to eat it. Period.
Yes, I know, pension funds and others bought the paper. Guess what — they did no diligence (or insufficient diligence) and they’re going to lose money as a result. That’s what’s supposed to happen when you do something stupid!
In point of fact it is the only way by which the market works. When you do smart things you make money. When you do dumb things you lose money. When you do really stupid things you go bankrupt.
There’s still time Ireland. Tell the banksters to get stuffed. Right here, right now.
As for Europe, same deal among their governments — including Greece. Tell the banksters to go to Hell.
As for here? Same deal. Got a loan out and are you tired of the “ethics” of these firms? Consult a tax and legal advisor, find out what can be done to you (if anything) if you tell them to go to Hell, and if that’s the correct business decision then tell them to blow their alleged debt out their ass.
Note carefully folks: American Airlines — a big corporation — just did exactly that.
They filed a preemptive bankruptcy to avoid paying for things they had agreed to pay for because they determined it was no longer to their advantage to do so.
WAKE UP IRELAND. WAKE UP GREECE.
And wake up AMERICA and AMERICANS.
There is NO moral obligation to pay. There is only the ability (or not) to enforce a contract.
By Larry Rubinoff, GoldmanSachs666
By James Howard Kunstler
on December 26, 2011 7:52 AM
Slouched in woe beside the Christmas tree, a lot of Americans missed the point of 2011: Santa Claus had already emptied his goodie sack before the night of wonders and miracles arrived and was back at the North Pole checking the balance sheet to see if he could raise a little cash selling some remaining assets off to the Blackstone Group or maybe work a leveraged buyout deal with Kohlberg Kravis Roberts. A few elves would have to join the unemployment line, but they could probably get by on half-rations of food stamps. Or maybe Henry Kravis could feed them reindeer steaks… at a discount, as long as they last.It's remarkable how the year's great mega-holiday blowout suspends time and circumstance. I didn't see how the European banks were going to make it to December 25, but then, heading into the shopping frenzy home-stretch, swap lines opened up between the US Federal Reserve and the European Central Bank and around $600-odd billion in ZIRP loans flowed to over 200 Euro banks. Maybe that will cover the next two weeks of aggregate debt rollovers, and then what? They can't even look forward to President's Day over there – unless we rented out the George Washington and Abe Lincoln brands to them.